Standing room only - IOC round table full house - Feb 6th 2024

Rate this item
(1 Vote)

Masterclass in Express Logistics for a network and natter with an agenda to deliver for.

Rich in sector knowledge, by top experts in the field.



Hydrogen trucks, EV derogation, drones and diesel values all at the table today. Melanie Stancliffe update on Deliveroo Supreme Court decision, impact of a future Labour govt. Parcel theft direct from the Home Office. DCI Ruth Tissington leading the team on serious crime in parcels. 4.25t EV and alternative fuel, van derogation rules by DfT Abdul Chowdhury. Royal Mail delivered drone project details and Chris Floyd asked you to check your danger spots on commercial vehicles.

Alderman Alison Gowman, City of London Corporation welcomed IOC fellows to the City of London Corporation's Guildhall for 6th Feb Inst of Couriers Heads of Industry round- table. Packed full house, standing room only, not an inch left at the table, as the giant turnout was treated to a magic agenda covering everything express. Fellows in strength from nationals, alongside regional courier companies in harmony of knowledge from worker status to future fuel values. Yi Liu from Bath University and Rena Rani from LSA took an opportunity to ask academic questions on future vision for logistics.

A network and natter to remember. IOC chair Carl Lomas did his traditional round table of introductions that asked the tough questions impacting sector this quarter. Competitive market, turnover, volumes, minimum wage, AI, EV, recruitment and retention, legislation, govt change, all featured in what was a network and natter to remember.

The first fellows round table of 2024 was hosted by City of London Corporation at Guildhall in the City of London. The first of the year roundtable did not disappoint. Free lunch for network and natter that was a who’s who of express logistics which included an informal exchange of knowledge skills and behaviour. IOC board members present included Paul Sainthouse and David Stringer Lamarre, David spoke equality and female inclusion to the express logistics sector.

It was an agenda rich in operator questions. Home Office on security in parcel- Abdul Chowdhury DfT on 4.25t EV derogation, spoke alternative fuel vehicle beyond EV regulations. Dr David Telford spoke UK-built HVS hydrogen trucks with electric drive train and 600km range to run from depot to depot. Melanie Stancliffe updated on latest Deliveroo Supreme Court decisions which provided the unions' view and what may lie ahead in a govt change for worker status and minimum wage conditions. Microlise, Richard Thorpe and James Duffey spoke Flare, Urban safety intelligence. Future oil values by Callum MacPherson Investec, detailed crude tankers that had always been too large to take the Suez route, but smaller refined fuel ships were discussed separately. IOC Road Safety group chair Chris Floyd reviewed the true value and cost of traffic accidents and asked for collaborative data on the dots of impacts for HGV trunking.

IOC CEO, Dr Tracey Worth chaired the speakers with a final round-up from external guest Detective Chief Inspector Ruth Tissington.

The Agenda Headlines delivered Feb 6th

DVSA 4.25t derogation for EV vans

Mr Abdul Chowdhury, DfT Head of Vehicle Policy, Office for Zero Emission Vehicles

Abdul explained UK’s decarbonisation and clean air objectives, with the Government looking at everything from HGV to e-scooters, and that by 2035 all new cars and vans must be zero emissions at the tailpipe. Electric vans are at an earlier phase of the transition compared to electric cars. Key considerations for vans include range, especially due to additional factors such as payload, and as such Government is taking forward several measures on charge infrastructure. Focus of today’s discussion is on additional regulatory support for the van market, and specifically on driving licence. A standard (Category B) driving licence allows you to drive up to 3.5t, with a derogation since 2018 allowing drivers to drive up to 4.25t for alternatively fuelled vehicles, to accommodate the extra weight of the powertrain (e.g. battery). This derogation is subject to some conditions: 5 hours of additional training; no towing allowance; and only applies to good vans. To further support the electric van transition, Government has announced it will remove these three conditions and tighten the scope from alternatively fuelled to zero emission only. Further details can be found here and the changes will come into effect after the legislation goes through Parliament later this year. An exemption for 4.25tn vehicles also exists for operator licencing rules and the Government is looking at the regulatory weight thresholds for these vehicles in other areas: MOT; drivers hours / tachographs; and speed limiters.

Melanie Stancliffe – Worker Status update – post Deliveroo Supreme Court

Melanie Stancliffe raised the recent Supreme Court decisions on Deliveroo. ‘The unions wanted to represent all riders, the key issue was could the unions show the riders were workers?’ Melanie reflected on the way Deliveroo dealt with worker status, substitutes, PAYE and insurance. Melanie explained these riders were not workers and there was no employment found. The key point was that a rider having a genuine and unfettered right to get a substitute to do the work was fatal to them being a worker. If we do have a Labour govt there will be a change to one category called “worker”. They will likely remove zero-hour contracts and likely looking at pay gap reporting. Melanie continued, changes to holiday pay on April 6th is coming. Looking at substitution, recent case on a dentist, using a locum, the court said if the individual has to check the registration or if they have been sacked by the employer before, that then is personal service so the individual is a worker.

Dr David Telford HVS – Hydrogen trucks

Hydrogen supply solved - 600km range, hub to hub route for refuelling

Dr David Telford, HVS Chief Scientific Officer joined the IOC round table Head of Industry on 6th February as a keynote speaker. As the transport industry faces into the challenge of decarbonisation, now is the perfect time to learn more about zero-emission vehicle technologies. David introduced HVS's native zero-emission green hydrogen fuel cell vehicle to the audience of Fellows. He explained how HVS's unique purpose-built design with their own chassis fully optimises operational efficiency, as well as safety and driver comfort. David shared how hydrogen as an alternative fuel source is particularly well suited to heavy goods vehicles due to long range, heavier payloads and fast refuelling times - helping industry to drive cleaner, perform better and decarbonise faster.

Dr David then spoke hydrogen supply solved with hub to hub range and mobile hydrogen supply. We are a start up in an industry dominated by seven brands. We have unique features; UK-based and manufacturing, Hydrogen fuel cell, EV power train, first UK vehicle designed and built from the ground up. Why Hydrogen fuel cells? There is no compromise on weight, it remains a 42 tonne load and has six hundred kilometre range, refuel takes fifteen minutes. Its all-weather use from minus 30 degrees. Power take off works conventionally, the truck can even run to deliver static power for fridge etc. Hydrogen supply for trucks is not the same as a car problem, we are focused on 600km hub to hub range. We can add mobile refuel trucks that can support ten trucks at a time at hub. Our investors are retail focused with hydrogen sale and infrastructure at their heart. Projection of cost is key, we need govt support to get you the price to work for a business model that works on the road. We also need a change on ADR to use hydrogen trucks to haul hydrogen gas fuel.

Finally, David explored the challenges and opportunities of using hydrogen for goods transport, including his cost of ownership predictions. For more information contact HVS at This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it..

Hot Agenda special on Security

IOC group security chair, Andy Magromallis introduced the Home Office and the regional crime squad. A security of parcel update followed (case studies have been removed).

Looking at Fast Parcels, organised crime, and operator communication, ‘We are asking for eyes and ears.’

Detective Chief Inspector attending along with the presenting officer Josh Thornton and a ROCU team from the West Midlands region with an Intelligence Manager from the UK Border force. Andrew Booth from the Home Office. ‘The focus is on the courier networks being used as distribution for organised crime and I believe issues around organised internet Fraud.’ (Sensitive material has not been disseminated beyond the round table.)

What can be said is Josh Thornton did introductions from a strong team via West Midlands regional crime unit that sits above regional level. Case studies discussed remained private, from organised crime to a talk to operators on tactics. ‘There has been large growth in Fast transport crime. Josh spoke about drugs being moved in the fast transport networks. 2.5kg is a fairly standard parcel weight. 6000 parcels recorded on last year. Josh spoke Cannabis, Sodium Nitrate, Meth. Firearms are a concern, as are knives and other weapons.

Andrew Booth from Home Office intelligence Air Cargo, we work collaboratively on serious organised crime, we need your eyes and ears. We work across govt and with partners, prioritising organised crime. Andrew focused on Pakistan parcels of drugs, it breaks down quickly to largely anonymous packets, these packets may appear to have UK trader send labels and consignment notes, it is easy to conceal a few boxes in a multi tonne load. We have looked at first mile, boxes delivered by cars into local stores. These chains grow quickly to tens of kilos of drugs at source. A number of case studies followed showcasing serious organised crime on a massive scale across freight borders. Your staff on the ground will know when they see something wrong, we need their intelligence. Andrew shared a variety of email contacts.

Callum Macpherson Investec – future oil values

Brent trading under eighty dollars a barrel.

Future fuel values look sound.

Brent presently trading under eighty dollars a barrel. Red Sea disruption, but market view is not expecting a fuel escalation. Callum, with an infographic of tanker size, reviewed what could go via Suez and what was too large. Many of the largest crude tankers have always gone around the Cape. A lens on refined product, a lot of refined fuel comes via smaller vessels that do travel on the Suez. Callum expanded: a lot of refined fuel, like diesel, comes via smaller vessels that do normally travel through the Suez Canal and a lot is imported into Europe from Asia, this is at greater risk of disruption than crude. Callum brought up the maps around Yemen and discussed weapons targeted on vessels.

Christopher Paxton - Royal Mail Drone project – National Courier Award winner

Drones are our Highlands & Islands solutions. Why Orkney? Density, space of water for trials.

Technology and regulation are our two constraints.

Christopher Paton, Royal Mail spoke about the Big Red Machine. Delivering 32 million addresses, 7.2 billion letters, 130 thousand employees, 85 thousand walkers on the streets at a door every day. 53 thousand vehicles. Over 1200 delivery offices. We are delivering the lowest carbon per item, we are working towards 50g of carbon per item. We see drones as our Highlands solution. A solution for the remote locations of the Highlands & Islands.

Why Orkney? Royal Mail brought drones to Orkney as it's very remote, density is low and a great deal of time is over water. Testing air over water is good. Orkney is part of the air mail history. We are moving to locally-produced hydrogen for the drones. We all want greater payload and longer range, but we need regulation change to allow such drones.

Iyla Watson from Skyports explained the operational detail of the autonomous drones, electric drones for remote areas. Taking aircraft, Australian Swoop Kite, about 120kmh, today the Speedbird carries a far great weight. We have the Piper Pelican, 400km carrying 180kg is available but restricted by regulations. We have flown medical in different locations around the world. We are looking to provide the most capable aircraft in the right locations, vision on range and weight. Pyka, Skyways, and Dufour were among future aircraft opportunity. Pyka is a vertical light opportunity, but not clear on regulations at this time.

Microlise Flare ‘Urban Safety Intelligence’ by Richard Thorpe & James Duffy

Richard and James explained Flare, Mobility safety Unit intelligence, detection, awareness, and response by data captured on the road. ‘The key is technology on fleets around the country to add to the data capture. It has saved four lives this year. This comes in an app, Deliveroo is a user.

Chris Floyd – Financial impact of traffic incidents in express

I want your dot data on truck damage from incidents.

IOC group sector chair Chris Floyd from Evri enlightened the message of road safety. Chris introduced the Evri driver of the year who drove the LPG Lord Mayor's Show tractor for the Institute of Couriers. Driver of the year data then drove research into cost of the fleet driver incidents. Talking assessment of HGV driver impact and cost metrics. Know damage, the accident pot is the big cost average in HGV. I want your data, the data that shows the impact zones of damage you are taking on your trucks. Chris pressed fellows to put forward their road safety members to engage with the IOC road safety group, a virtual hour bi-monthly to share best practice, the next event is at ten on Feb 19th, email your team member to attend to Dr Tracey Worth IOC. This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.

Photo Gallery

2024 news feb heads of industry 02

Keynote on EV derogation by Abdul Chowdhury


2024 news feb heads of industry 03

Callum Macpherson Investec talks tanker size impact for Suez and fuel values


2024 news feb heads of industry 03

Melanie Stancliffe talks worker status in express


2024 news feb heads of industry 05

Microlise Flare saving lives with data on traffic

2024 news feb heads of industry 06

Fellows focused at table